Wednesday, September 21, 2011

A Dear John Letter

Following the stoush in the previous comments I thought it might be enlightening to see what led to it and what it all means. I expect that there are people out there who will view the whole thing as the paranoid ravings of a madman, not to mention a flagrant disregard for all rules of common decency. But that's alright - I really don't care. I'm nobody and you can kill if him you like. One day I'll no longer be here and what will it matter?

Furthermore I should also add that whilst the following is intended primarily for those of us who are anti-death cult, it will also effectively function as a debrief for spooks keen to avoid the missteps that would otherwise give them away as cointelpro. But there's nowt to be done for that and we'll just have to carry on regardless.

First up: Statcounter. For those who don't know, statcounter is a website, one of many, that one can plug one's blog into and be given details of who hits what and when. Only I can access my statcounter of course - all you get is a single number at the bottom of this page's right hand column (which at time of writing stands at 241,579).

I can understand certain people might view this with a degree of alarm. All I can say is, better you know about it than not, what with every site you go to recording details much like the ones I shall lay out here. The only difference between them and me is that I tell you about it.

Confession time: I'm a statcounter junkie. I find it beyond fascinating. But by the same token it's also a lot like trawling through shit looking for pearls. Here are some pearls I've saved with an eye to one day putting them up here:

Ah, yes. Heartwarming and good clean fun. And the DHS! The US taxpayer's dollars at work. But as if any of us are surprised. And whilst I doubt that that fellow was looking for an image of a cum-spattered Australian Prime Minister, that's what he got, ha ha.

Along those lines, I find myself fascinated by google drop-ins. God knows this blog is perversely desultory (or is that desultorily perverse? Perhaps the latter. I shan't say 'eclectic' since that would be putting on airs), so inevitably most arrivals from google, searching say for ten plagues of passover, will find themselves in amongst waaay more information than they wanted.

But for those of you who've read this far and are wondering what I make of you, would you be disappointed if I said, nothing at all? Approximately half of all hits to this blog look like this:

They read what's on the front page and don't bother with the comments and nor do they click any images or links. They just want the text and they're off. And fair enough. I invariably do the same myself as I wander around the net. And who is that person in London? Hell if I know. Not only do I have no idea, I really don't care. Even if I did, I have no means of finding out anything beyond what you see there. WYSIWYG.

The other half of my hits are best exemplified by the following two grabs:

I like these people, whoever they are. They check out a couple of images and links and otherwise spend a bit of time. Hats off. I invariably do the same myself as I wander around the net. The only thing I know about them (that I don't know about the preceding individual) is how long they spent here. A single hit gives me no idea whether someone stayed for a second or an hour. Two hits or more and I can take a guess. It has to be a guess on account of the possibility of whoever it was having left their computer to make a coffee or somesuch. And if anyone can recognise themselves in any of the preceding three, consider me impressed. The service provider I'm currently availing myself of seems to shift its virtual location so often I can't even recognise myself. Ha!

But then again, I'm not looking neither. All of the three preceding are of no interest to me at all. I grabbed them because they are to statcounter hits what John is to men's names. They're merely more of the same that I have to plough through in my search for attention grabbers like the DHS, Fort Huachuca, The House of Commons, the Whitehouse, and The Office of the President of the United States. I've had hits from all of those by the way, with the last one involving someone googling the McMartin scandal curiously enough. And sure, it could be an intern taking a break from blowjob duty but either way a hit is a hit and bragging rights ensue.

After several years of this one becomes inured to the humdrum. But one also becomes attuned to oddities, things that not only stick out like the proverbial but have you wondering at the curious logic that drives them. Like the individual in Seattle, Washington who hits the same page dating from January 2010 up to five times a day, day in, day out. What the hell is that? What's the point of hitting a page that's never going to update? A complete stumper.


And then there's John Friend of San Diego who, if he was to tell you one single thing about himself it's that there were no planes at 911. Did he mention that there were no planes? Because there were no planes at 911. It's interesting that, how there were no planes. Everyone talks about 911 but there were no planes there. Oh! Just remembered! There were no planes at 911! Ha ha ha, what a laugh, no planes at 911, he says.

Does anyone play that silly game Who would you invite to your ideal dinner party? I do. I'd have my faves from QI, Bill Bailey, Alan Davies, and Rich Hall, Aangirfan's schoolgirls, David Bowie, P2P, Hugo Chavez, English John, and um... Vincent Cassel! Like I'd fail to invite myself to my own party? No doubt this party might be a bit stilted at first but once the Stoly started to flow we'd hit full gear. Stories! Jokes! Smutty double entendres! Laugh! What a swell party we'd have! Right up until fucking John Friend walks in to tell us there were no planes at 911. Shit! And we were having such a good time!


John sure enough, has charted his own weird course through statcounter. Truth be known, on its own it would have been unremarkable. However, when you lay it side by side with what he's saying and doing in the blog, all sorts of things become clear.

I first noticed him by way of an arrival via direct link from a Mr. Friend's Blog. Hmm... curious. And sure it sounded like some creepy paedophile thing, but whatever, I go check it out. As a chap not often linked to (astounding given that I'm easily the best writer since William McGonagall) I always check such things out and then keep an eye on it to see how much traffic it generates. At time of writing: nada - just that single solitary hit. Would anyone blame me if I was to declare that that was merely John checking to see if his link worked?

So I visit his site and instantly notice he's also linked to my haiku blog. Double curious. Not a single arrival from there which means he didn't even bother checking the link. Doubtless he didn't actually care, what with never having written a haiku (that being the whole point of the place). And this after a single visit - one hit, no haiku, but he likes it enough to link to it. Sure. But let's not jump the gun and start using the word 'glad-handing' yet. We'll save it for later.

Like the haiku blog, John loved the church after his very first visit. He liked it so much he didn't need to look around, hang out in the comments, click any links, nothing. A blink was all it took and he was sold! Love at first sight - "Let's not fool around baby, let's just go to Vegas and get married!" - and he promptly pledged his troth with a link. Wow. Talk about swept off my feet! Or not. Probably not actually, now that I think about it.

On the same day, he pops into the comments for Pedophocracy Disinfo 102 which I loosely paraphrase thus -
1) Dropped Aangirfan's name, said he loved my blog.

2) Made a single para almost-on-topic comment about the twenty year old Franklin Scandal and condemns paedophiles to hell. *For those who don't know the Franklin scandal is the only scandal to have made the front page of any major US daily, albeit not in connection to any other scandal. It's also the only scandal that Mike Rivero is prepared to mention on his blog without condemnation (as he does with the McMartin scandal). And it's also the scandal which I have previously declared to be the limited hang-out fall-back position for pedophocracy disinfo spooks. Not that I'm accusing John of that, or anything. Oh, nearly forgot: John was a kid in Nebraska at the precise time Franklin was going down and associated with many of the same people and organisations that were involved. Not that he had any idea at the time of course.

3) Writes nine paras detailing how there were no planes on 911.

4) Once more tells me I am great.

5) Reappears with a second comment asking for my insight into whether Paul McCartney really is dead. No seriously, he did. Also writes 'LOL' for the third time, not that that makes me grit my teeth or anything.
John's penultimate misstep came when he arrived at the last piece wherein I discussed his favourite topic in the world. Unlike the curious people at Kenny's who checked out his no-plane links, and unlike the average 'interested' punters above, John was filled with an insatiable incuriosity and completely failed to click on a single link, pic, or movie. His utter lack of desire to check out my blog, which he professed to like so much, was here perfectly replicated by his complete uninterest in checking out an article pretty much written for him. It's all he can talk about but really, he just ain't interested. Go figure.

Did somebody says 'figures'? What with yours truly being a complete maths wizard, why don't we mathematically compare John Friend's curiosity in his professed field of interest with that of a standard punter. As we can see, as the standard punter's interest in a given topic increases, his curiosity charts a concordant rise. John Friend on the other hand follows a curve of inverse proportion. Thus as his interest in a given topic hits maximum his curiosity scrapes zero. Like that makes any sense at all. Otherwise, Descartes, eat your heart out!

As I said in the comments there, the only time I've encountered such extraordinary incuriosity in the face of professed interest is with blank-eyed zionists and pedophocracy disinfo scum. It ain't great company to be in, is it? And John's response? He did click some links! What's that John, fingers crossed and a quickly muttered, 'he durst not give me the lie direct.' Ha ha ha ha - durst I not? Bullshit. I fucking durst.

Dear oh dear. So much for that. But John wasn't done yet. He still had one last nail to hammer into his own coffin. Never mind me having called him bullshit and telling him to fuck off, nor him saying he'd knock my teeth out (yeah, yeah, you and stevieb, the apple onion, and zionists too numerous to mention) the next day he... wait for it... came back pushing his piss-weak no-planes barrow and acting like nothing had ever happened.

Huh? I shake my head. Who the fuck does that? I can imagine all sorts of responses but that's just too weird for itself. Mate, do you even know how a normal person behaves?


Cointelpro exists. Cointelpro is not passive. It is aggressive. They do not sit at their computers playing the ghost surfer. They go out and they pile in. That's what cointelpro is. And not in any half-arsed way. Remember they are not passive. They will do their level best to become big wheels. They will clock up hours. They will dominate the discussion. They will be tireless and busy and full of enthusiasm. They will network and make links. They will be charming and complimentary and have their gladhanding down pat. Will they want to be your friend? Abso-fucking-lutely. Hell, they've studied the art of making people trust them. They have sincerity down pat. And they depend upon your credulity and unwillingness to think ill of people.

And if you think you're safe because you only get a thousand hits a day, go read up on all those peace activist groups who warranted a full-time infiltrator who would live and work amongst them for a year, and the group only had an effective membership of a couple dozen people. The internet and blogs are not going to get a free ride. If you frequent these circles you will encounter cointelpro. It's a dead certainty. The good news is they will give themselves away. And he did!

NB. Edited 22 September as noted in the comments


nobody said...

And if anyone is bummed that they missed an invite to dinner, don't worry. That's just dinner. Once that's over at ten o'clock you're all invited to come on down. You know who you are.

And what a swell party we'll have!

And how did bloody Ollie Reed get in there? I expect that's John Frampton's doing. Never mind, Ollie's good for a giggle, as long as he doesn't break any furniture.

slozo said...

I am bummed.

Not about dinner though.

You may be right about this guy, Nobody - you just might be. But then again, you might not, and I have not really seen anything that seals it for me amongst your evidence.

Furthermore, you again - as in the no-planes talk - misrepresent some things. You say that he acted as if nothing happened afterward . . . when in fact (I was just in that comments section) he was clearly pissed about it. Even said that face to face, he'd smack you in the face for it. That is what I would characterise as pissed.

And frankly, that also goes against usual cointelpro style. Seriously . . . it's always jab a bit, then we get REALLY upset, it's ignore or take a step and say "just joking" or some kind of concilliatory gesture. So, to actually state how pissed he was at you for saying that . . . I thought myself that the way he writes was not spooky at all, other than the Paul is dead thing - which I sort of took in a light hearted way.

But like I said, maybe he is. Maybe you have a better nose for it, and can make these leaps to a conclusion before a really full-bore attack . . . but relying on some stat counter stuff with the fact that he is pushing the theory that no planes hit the towers . . . I don't know, a bit thin, IMHO.

Not everyone needs to hit links they have seen before, btw. I didn't look through 30 seconds of the first one going by memory (had seen it before, and could see that you had chosen a very simplistic one), and didn't look at the second I think - to me, the videos were pointless for what you were trying to argue. As if showing bad or inconclusive proofs for point A qualified point B.

Hope you're right on John Friend, Nobody.

I still like ya, but . . . ah jeez, I just realised.

If I give you a compliment now, I'LL be cointelpro, lol.

Ah fuck, you hate that too . . . later! And please . . . just consider my thoughts here.

Timster said...

hmmm...dammit. Now you have made me think. Amazing how the subject of your post got so popular so fast. Folks like we have been plugging away for years defending defensible but narrow pov's...and in a matter of months this guy is making radio appearances and getting picked up by the biggest "alternative" sites out there. I was one of the sites he "fell in love with". Again you made me think. There are no sour grapes here and I wish the best for those successful at getting the REAL message to the masses...but I'm not seeing the real message at his blog. Like you, I am seeing too many associations with known disinfo folks. Oh well, we can't be made to believe something we don't. But it breaks the heart to have to suspect others...and we DO have to.
Good piece.

Anonymous said...

Hi Nobody!

Food for thought: I access your blog from different locations; sometimes I am at work, sometimes I am at home, sometimes I am on my mobile device. I suspect this would appear as 3 distinct and unrelated visitors?
Perhaps Mr Friend does the same and has seen more than you can tell by the statcounter.
best regards,

RPthaChozen1 said...

Your argument sounds completely circumstantial. I honestly don't know why you are so flustered about the comments he made... What happened to those by the way? I can't seem to find his original response. Seems pretty biased to delete comment and rip them without presenting what was originally stated. It seems to me that you may have an alternate agenda. But none of this even matters, you'll probably end up deleting this post too.

P2P said...

I am as baffled as I usually am around an unraveling cockfight, and thus very grateful for you deciding to serve stolichnaya for dinner.

from what I've observed when comparing statcounter to other counters is that it does not register all hits, for whatever reason.

the seattle person has probably more or less accidentally saved the post you mentioned as a start up page or other such a page which loads up automatically when he opens his browser. or then he is a bot of some sort, meaning a robot which is for whatever reason made to surf through your lot regularly (one reason can be the manipulation of google pageranks, which can be done, though not as effectively as through other means, by creating bots which do their surfing through external servers to sites which somebody wills to climb high in google's ranks. you know, just creating traffic out of thin air).

A13 said...

Hi Nobody,
well that's an eye opener and has got me thinking.
I'm only a pup in the blogsphere and at most get about 200 hits a day, but i don't have the stat counter thing, i have the feedjit one, so maybe i should change?
The cointelpro stuff bothers me as we already have to discern who is genuine and who is disinfo, and some other bloggers i'm friends with ( good people) have helped me when i've had disinfo trolls and the like pop in to create chaos,so i'm greatfull for that.
I like the idea of a stolly party , mind if i crash? not corey worthington style of course ;)
I'll bring the bolly then..sweetie darling :)

and what you said here "go read up on all those peace activist groups who warranted a full-time infiltrator who would live and work amongst them for a year, and the group only had an effective membership of a couple dozen people. "
Yes, so true, this reminds me of that Mark stone/ kennedy guy fiasco that happened earlier this year in the UK..what a total headfuck, really worse than the stasi.
trust..over the invisible sphere of the net is difficult and i have been recently burned by a so called "blogging" friend, so now i've had to re evaluate my discernment and intuition abilities which usually are pretty spot on..we are all fallibl;e.
for the record..I'm not a no planer..
Cheers again.

A. Peasant said...

is this so? i did not know this (quoting Timster):

in a matter of months this guy is making radio appearances and getting picked up by the biggest "alternative" sites out there.

Anonymous said...

It appears that "nobody" has finally lost what little bit of sanity he had left. Or hes cashing in his disinfo chips and going all in...

The Realist Report said...

Well nobody, you've outed me man. My handlers over in Langley and Tel Aviv have instructed me to quit wasting my time here at your blog and at Timster's blog. Obviously, you guys know everything, and can spot us spooks lickedy split.

I've been instructed to continue pushing major disinfo on my blog and a few others, namely highlighting the fact that Zionist Jews did 9/11, they own the US government, media and banking industry, and it is this issue we must confront if we want real freedom back anytime soon.

slozo, I hope nobody considers your comment, too.

Hey Timster, fuck you, too.

A. Peasant, I've had a few of the posts I've done relating to 9/11 linked to, The Ugly Truth, and Daryl Bradford Smith's Mark Glenn invited me on his radio program, which I accepted. You can find this radio interview at my blog if you want to check it out.

I'll have a response on my blog soon.

Timster said...

Hey John...put your bruised weewee back in your pants and read my comment again...

Edo said...

One thing the whole NPT thing proves is that it's very divisive.

I was quite convinced myself after reading some of the material, but it's a rabbit hole I don't like to hang about in. Just look at the company you're in when you do: Ace Baker, Killtown, Judy Wood, Webfairy, Simon Shack and lets not forget our antipodean friend Genghis.

I'll tell you what made me ditch it, and that was Marcus Allan. Summed up by Nobody when he said, "Cointelpro exists. Cointelpro is not passive. It is aggressive. They do not sit at their computers playing the ghost surfer. They go out and they pile in. That's what cointelpro is. And not in any half-arsed way. Remember they are not passive. They will do their level best to become big wheels. They will clock up hours. They will dominate the discussion. They will be tireless and busy and full of enthusiasm. They will network and make links. They will be charming and complimentary and have their gladhanding down pat. Will they want to be your friend? Abso-fucking-lutely. Hell, they've studied the art of making people trust them. They have sincerity down pat. And they depend upon your credulity and unwillingness to think ill of people."

Spot on, although I just thought he was a cock at the time.

nobody said...

Hi Boys and Girls,

Rather than write a too long response here I put a too long addendum on the front page immediately following the piece as it once stood. Will anyone want to read it now? It's so fucking long that even I'd think twice about it. Anyway, it's all there now.

And John was in was he? Pathetic. Nice red herring about Mossad mate. Do you carry those herrings around with you? Because God knows there was no mention of Mossad here. Anyway, the herrings would certainly explain the fishy smell.

As for Mossad, if you wanted to complain about something it should have been me using you as a prop to discuss the pedophocracy. But what with your blog being one of those all-Israel-all-the-time blogs (with a tip of the limited hang-out hat to the Franklin scandal - spookily like Mike Rivero) I expect you'd rather eat your own earwax than go anywhere near such a conversation. Am I right?

And I bet Dave McGowan makes you break out in boils yeah? I'm thinking I've got your number.

And write your piece, I look forward to it. You got nothing on me and we both know it. I'll make a prediction - you will address nothing in here i've written about that concerns the falseness of your behaviour. You'll avoid it like the plague. Your piece will be entirely couched in terms of all the good work you do and how I'm bad because I've disobeyed all the rules of civil discourse.

I make this prediction because I don't think you've got anywhere else to go. And also because you haven't addressed any of the front page questions here. Thinking about it, you never have addressed anyone's questions anywhere ever. In the discussions over at Kenny's you ignored every question, rebuttal, comment, everything.

You were only capable of one thing and you did it over and over and over - you'd simply restated the same thing again and again, insist we check your links, and then express incredulity that we fall down at the brilliance of it. That's you John. Pissweak.

This should be good. I can't wait. You are so out of your depth mate.

nobody said...

Sorry Slozo, I'll drop you a line tomorrow. Right now my eyes are glazing over with exhaustion. I was up until 2am last night doing that thing. And today was a long day. What time is it? 8.30pm. Jesus. I'm shattered.

nobody said...

And everybody else too. Sorry. It's just that I had Slozo on my mind. Whilst I like heaping shit on bulshit artists, I'd be unhappy if people who weren't bullshit were to get spattered.

Anyway boys and girls, back tomorrow.

nobody said...

Just had an afterthought while I was making the yoghourt.

John, what with you not having read any of my blog, you have no idea of who I am, where I'm coming from, or how my brain works. When you write your thing and I drop into your comments you won't even know what hit you. I'm pretty sure you're going to have to censor my comment.

Actually, why don't I tell you up front? This is a trap mate. And I'm pretty sure you're going to fall into it. Pretty sure. I checked out your blog and I have a good handle of where your head is at.

I'll even tell you how the trap works. You're going to be faced with an impossible choice. You won't want to print my comment. And you won't want to censor me. Because if you do, sure enough, I'm coming straight back here, I'm going to post it, and I'm going to call you.

Do you know what I'm talking about?

You can't say I didn't warn you.

My earnest advice to you is that you cop the hiding you got here today, shut the fuck up, and skulk off in shame. And sure, act like nothing ever happened. Ask some heavies and see if that isn't the smart money.

But it's up to you mate. Do whatever you're going to do and I'll do whatever I'm going to do and we'll see how things shake out.

Just as long as you don't think I'm shy. I ain't, I'm up for it, and this is my idea of a sport.

See how you go.

Anonymous said...

"nobody" was molested as a kid so in turn he attacks anyone who does not devote as much time and energy to talking about pedophilia as he does as a "pedo" themselves. "nobody" appears to be a deeply damaged, deeply disturbed individual.

The Realist Report said...

Hey Timster, I went back and re-read your comment. And yes, you can still go fuck yourself buddy.

nobody, I haven't read Dave McGowan's work to tell you the truth. But I am familiar with the whole global pedophile/Satanic network issue. Obviously, I haven't studied it or written about it nearly as much as you. Are you implying that I shy away from this issue? Have I not made it clear here and elsewhere that these motherfuckers deserve to roast in hell for what they've done and continue to do? Did I not say that after reading DeCamp's book I was completely devastated? It's still devastating to even think about what happened in this case and in many other cases.

You write in your addendum:

"Why should I let motherfuckers, whether zionists, white supremacist racist arseholes, pedophocracy disinfo scum, ot whomever, come in here to my place and use it as a platform to spout their hateful shit?"

This may be the most perplexing comment coming from you yet- what have I ever said, anywhere at any time, whether on your blog or other blogs we frequent, that is "hateful"? All I've done is point out why I disagree with you about the planes issue, and why your analysis of Killtown's article was so flawed. Can you point out, specifically, where I've been "hateful"? Jeez, you sound like the fucking ADL man.

I've already written my response, it was posted last night. Please stop by and comment. I do not censor anyone's comments, unless they are just completely out of line (which some have been in the past, not from you, but from Anonymous commenters). I look forward to your feedback.

kikz said...

hmmmmmmm. the plot thickens..........

interesting forensics on the statcounter biz.

and y, i'm pouting, but i'll get over it.. picky eater that i am...

bill bailey? as in the comedian/musician that was in the beeb's "Black Books" w/another fav of mine...dylan moran?

stoly? noooooo... vodka does weird stuff to my knees.. i lose them :) i'll bring my bottle of socio-politically incorrect black bat.... i imagine, i can still be somewhat entertaining/witty under the influence of alcohol. been so long, i dunno, but will refrain frm being an eeyore to enlighten... my last post on the creeper dad was verbally diarrheal enuff :P)

on and lastly... an author i've recommended at times; JL Lash... for various mythical meanderings... has just come out as a dr. judyITE.. it's has me concerned... but... peepz do hav their own core subject matters and areas of expertise, maybe he is just out of his technical depth w/that one.. kind of a nose crinkle thing for me.. as opposed to an 'OMG he's totally lost his mind' type feeling. of course i could be wrong and he has... to utilize a southernism... 'dropped his basket'. but then again, one can lose things out of one's basket and not drop the entire basket...

so, 10P it is :) cya!

grassapelli said...

Yes, the post is a bit long. Especially when the graph really makes the point so well.

If I'm passionate about a subject, I'll follow a lot of links to get into it.

I wrote a post on Dr Judy Wood's book, Where Did the Towers Go. She raises questions no one else seems to find interesting.

My favorite WTC Building is #6, the apple-cored one.

Back to your point. You made it convincingly for me by a couple of paragraphs after the elegant chart.

Still, we get paid by the word, don't we?

nobody said...

Jesus Christ, just scrolling down to the comments was a chore.

And hullo Grassapelli, LTS. And no link? I'm always up for whatever. Judy Wood, sure. No planes sure. I'll check them out, have a bit of to and fro, it's all good.

What I'm not up for is relentless, broken-record, one-trick ponies who are perfectly incurious and are completely uninterested in anything anyone else has to say.The fact that they're insincere, glad-handing bullshit artists who precisely resemble spooks doesn't help neither.

As for Judy Wood, I've got more time for all of that than I have for no planes. Given that, well... let's call them DEW's, would comprise an adjunct to the explosives and thermite we know were there, I have no problems with it. Were such technology to exist, 911 would have made a perfect testing ground for them. Succeed or fail, it doesn't really matter. It's just another piece of overkill which, on a day where the only rule was It must not fail would have come under the heading of 'it's all good'.

The no-planes thing on the other hand necessarily stands as an either/or equation. Either there were planes, or there were no planes. The question then becomes - which would do the job better? Anyway I've discussed all that.

But back to the DEW's and no-planes: they always seemed to connected, ie. you discuss one and you inevitably find yourself discussing the other. The conventional wisdom is that DEW's are tied to no-planes to make the no-planes appear crazy. Maybe, but me, I like to turn it on its head. What if it's not a case of no-planes being discredited by DEW craziness but vice versa? There's a logic to DEW's, but none that I can see for no-planes.

Or let's put it this way, if DEW's are crazy talk to divert discussion from no-planes, what is it that's being protected? Video fakery? And is that some kind of holy-of-holies? Hardly. At best, it's just another trail that might conceivably lead us to the culprits of 911. But nano-thermite and vertical free-fall buildings will do the job perfectly well, and besides we have proof of those.

DEW's on the other hand is a whole other conversation. They would equate to a latter day equivalent of the splitting of the atom. Given that technology only ever accelerates why shouldn't there be some new version of the theory of relativity? Einstein wrote that over a hundred years ago. So aren't we due for something? Or to put it another way, were something as momentous as this to arrive would we declare that there was no way that man was capable of such things?

And then here's another question (which knowing the audience, should only elicit one answer): If such a thing were invented how likely would it be that the US military would lay their hands on it and keep it as a secret? What if there was free power for all Nicola Tesla style? Might they want to keep that a secret? Imagine if we all had power. And sure pwer means one thing there but it means the other thing too. With our own power, we are no longer subject.

And so! What if the no-logic no-planes was a poison-the-well cover for a perfectly logical DEW prototype test. That works for me just fine.

God, I am a bloody genius! A revelation to myself! Off I go now! It's time for me to become that broken record and insist that everyone acknowledge the rightness of my argument. And if you don't like it, I'll just say it again and again and again.

Franz said...

Nobes, this time I read the WHOLE blog. Very interesting.

When add reviews at Amazon now they allow comments and you know what? Comment on one "911 truth" book or one "JFK conspiracy"
book and see the barnacles you gather. LOTS.

So it's like that everywhere, I guess. I am totally honest about Amazon, anyone wanting to back me up here can. I did a review of a book on Julius Caesar's assassination and... right... a JFK debunker actually spammed my email box. After years at Amazon, never trying to by anonymous, I hide my email now.

Oh, while I'm at it... if you got a pal with a mail box who don't mind you taking one (1) delivery there, let me know. I'll send you a dank-but-watchable DVD copy of ROOTS OF HEAVEN. I don't want your real address, I'm a bookdealer and I've done this before. Also you can have it sent to "Mister Dowd, c/o local public library" and I can get it to you that way if you like.

Either way you really might find an intro to ROOTS OF HEAVEN interesting, even if the movie is not perfect. Nobody knew in the fifties when it was made had a clue what kind of world was coming. But we know now.

Or not. If you suspect anything I'll understand also and just forget I offered. Best regards.

nobody said...

Nearly forgot! The big stoush with John Friend...

Last night there I was all bloody and hell-bent and up for something (but too tired to start). And then this morning I woke up and was instantly bored to tears with the whole thing. Suddenly I veiwed as just more homework.

And I wondered, Could I even be fagged going over there and seeing what he wrote? It's not as if it's going to be interesting or enlightening or any other useful thing is it?

So I wondered if it might not be more amusing just to leave John standing there with his second, waiting for me to turn up. And the more I thought about it, the more I liked it. What's the point of talking to a broken record? What purpose is there to doing anything beyond calling it and then finding something more interesting to do?

And sure, John will view that as a victory and brag wherever, but what do I care? He can think whatever the fuck he likes. And tell everyone he can think of No skin off my nose.

Not forgetting that John is paragon of incuriousness and has never been given pause by anything anyone has said ever, as far as I can tell. So why would I bother engaging with him? To achieve what?

So John, off you go, go and trash my rep. I'm happy to let you do this because I don't have one. Unlike you I don't zip hither and yon glad-handing people in order that they all link to me. Nor do I beaver away at making a big name for myself getting on this show, that show, onwards and upwards. If anything I could more accurately be described as one of those fellows who bites the hand that feeds him.

I'll admit that I briefly used to send things to Mike Rivero and he'd publish them occasionally (provided they were about Israel). But once he started knocking me back when I wrote about subjects that came under his heading of 'off limits' I gave up on him.

And now, I'm... what am I on about? Hmm... I'm thinking that'll be the next front page. You can read it there if you want. Not that it's got anything to do with you of course.

BTW. I was very impressed with you swotting up on my blog last night. You really resembled an actual fan. If only you'd done it earlier. And if only I was going to turn up at your place so that you could put your newly found knowledge to use. Never mind.

Oh, not forgetting of course that it's not completely impossible that you're capable of writing something worth reading. Stranger things have happened at sea. If such a thing does occur would someone here (who isn't a bullshit anon) stop by and tell me? If someone worthy says so, I'll go check it out. Otherwise I just couldn't be fagged writing another word about you. You just ain't worth it.

Ha! And if the words on the tip of your tongue are, 'And you're not worth it either', allow me to say that you're absolutely right. I ain't.

Now off you go and enjoy your big victory parade down the Via Triumphalis to the accompaniment of imaginary horns and with a cardboard cutout of Vincent Cassell's head on a pole. Where's Michael Bentine's Potty Time when you really need it?

anyway ciao boys and girls, back later


Anonymous said...

nobody, for a guy who "doesn't care what people think" you sure do tell us how you "don't care what people think" of you a lot.

And for saying John Friend doesn't deserve another word from you, you sure did just write quite a few towards him. Make up your fucking mind you assclown.

Anonymous said...

Judy Wood is a joke, I don't even think the 9/11 terrorists(the real ones) who put her out there thought her disinfo campaign would pull so many retards in. They must be very pleased.

It was a controlled demolition, not space beams or whatever the fuck Wood is calling it. Fucking retards. Especially you "nobody". So you don't fall for the "no planes" disinfo but Wood fooled you? Fucking retard.

Peter said...

lol **grinning**
who said you were a wanker?
(he bop, indeed)

slozo said...


I hear ya Nobody, I know you'll get back to me. Inevitably, we'd just meet in disjointed dialogue in some forgotten comments section anyways, as usual. No worrie smate.

But I did need to comment on the comments . . . it's spooky, isn't it? Makes me think you were righter than ever on the aforementioned victim of your vicious assails . . . in a way. Not from HIS comments, mind you - but more from other ones, if YOU can dig it (sorry to turn your fave phrase on you, but I do love it so myself by coincidence).

Interesting stuff, and not entirely unintentionally hoped for from my "friend-to-friend calling you on something" dialogue. It was a half-assed thing (in retrospect, not giving myself much credit for it) that would certainly elicit certain responses from certain corners, and would certainly have gone a long way to confirming or not confirming things . . . and it has done that for me.

Confirm things for me, that is. In a good way, that is, towards yourself being right on the spook.

And also towards myself being right on no planes.

If you dig. Through all my double talk (apologise in advance).

Curiouser und curiouser, as they say.

slozo said...

Franz - is Roots of Heaven not available in paperback, here in the FREE WORLD of North America?

You know, we have tough dudes in huge military installations and high tech skull stomping tanks fighting for our freedoms by eradicating the women and children of the brown-ish world.

Should be able to pick a book up like that at the library, no?

I'm teasing, but I am curious about the book now with that story!

nobody said...

Sorry Slozo,

In yesterday's writing frenzy I didn't pay enough attention to the comments. First up I didn't misrepresent his anger thing. Sure he got angry, but after that he came back and acted like nothing happened. Unless I'm going mad?

No, No, I just checked and that's how it went down and that's how I wrote about it. Imagine you were thrown out of a bar (or you stomped out, whatever) on account of getting into a screaming match, complete with explicit threats of violence. This bar, sure enough, isn't your local and you have no friends there. And nor is it the only bar in the street - there's a dozen within easy walking distance.

Anyway ten minutes later you walk back in and act like nothing ever happened. That strikes me as odd. If there were no other bars, or if it was your local, or your friends were there - sure. But what sort of weirdo would walk back into a room full of not only strangers, but friends of the proprietor with whom you had the slanging match? And you then attempt to engage them in the same conversation that got you thrown out, like nothing had happened. Who would do that and why?

Okay, okay, a drunk person sure. That'll teach me to use a bar analogy. But seriously if that happened in the real world brows would be furrowed, heads would be scratched, and the question would have to be asked, "What the fuck is this guy up to?" Because it wouldn't make any sense. And John's behaviour didn't either. And not as a first offence neither. By that stage I was convinced and this piece of weirdness was just the cherry on the cream.

Also the point I was trying to make overall in the piece was that I was using statcounter as a tool to analyse behaviour which was senseless to begin with. Uh oh, perhaps I need another addendum wherein I include everything that had gone on at Kenny's? Nah. I'll spare us.

The thing was, John had already had me scratching my head over his weird behaviour at Kenny's and then he comes here acting like we hadn't already given this a couple of go-rounds already. And does it all over again. Then I reach for statcounter and start putting two and two together. Sure enough the weird picture then got weirder. Had his trail through statcounter been normal there'd have been nothing to write. Prior to me checking statcounter I had suspicions sure but no 'lie direct'. After I checked statcounter, my suspicions were confirmed.

And if you go back and look you'll see me break off mid-sentence. This was due to me realising that this was the fourth time I'd shot down the silly 'what if they missed argument'. And the thought went through my head, 'Does this guy read anything?' And I knew who he was already (what with the link), and I thought, 'why don't I go look'. And that was the end of that. Then I came back and was no longer interested in talking about no-planes. I wanted to talk about him. Because statcounter had shown him up as bullshit.

And that was the moment. You can see it. It's right there.


nobody said...

As for your no-planes argument, and your quoting of Gallier, mate what are you doing? You're putting arrows in my quiver. I did keep an open mind. I repeatedly kept trooping off and checking no-planer's links. And like I said, I thought they were all crap. The guy who didn't keep an open mind (because he hasn't got one) is John Friend. Go tell him, mate.

And finally, I didn't pick those two youtube movies because they were easy. They were merely the first cabs off the rank. I went to youtube typed in no-planes and they were at the top of the list. But like I said I've checked it all out before. I've seen all of them. This was probably my third or fourth time. I gave it a really good bash. And I never saw anything that impressed.

Otherwise mate, the point of the exercise in my no-plane piece, and I was pretty explicit, was rather than bat down piece after piece of evidence with a seemingly long line stretching off to infinity, why don't we just get global? I mean, how much of this shit do I have to wade through? Or to put it another way: how much do I have to go through before I stop and ask, 'What the fuck is going on here?' Particularly when it seems any goddamn thing will do. I shot down two. First cabs off the rank.

And if we're going to be global the obvious question is 'why'. Why would some use 'some other mysterious thing' when you've got perfectly good planes that will do the job just dandy.

And the only responses I've had to that were all supposition and 'what-if'. Nuts! Is that it? That's all they've got? And that's worth splitting the 911 movement over, is it?

Here's the obvious next sentence; Well it is if you're ................... Do you need me to tell you what group of people's name gets put on the dotted line there?


nobody said...

Otherwise, you need to stop lobbing me this piece, that piece - an engine, a seismic record, whatever. This is a process that can go on forever. You've got to view it globally. Or holistically if you prefer. Which we can do from two angles. One is the question I already asked above. 'Why would you bother'. The other question would have to be, 'How come the no-planes case consists of an endless line bits and bits, and yet has no compelling reason for the why?'.

And then there's the question I asked above. 'Even if this is true, what will it achieve that obviousness of the collapses and the evidence of thermite and molten steel couldn't do quicker and better?' And with less side effects, ie. having people think you're a loony?

The more I think about it, the more convinced I am that no-planes wedge is the obvious, indeed the only possible strategy open to the government. They'd have to do it. They've got nothing else. Things are such now that there's more and better media disputing the government's case then there is for it.

I think a shift is coming soon. Have you noticed that this no-plane thing is really getting amped up lately? Certainly there seems to be a lot of people flooding all the places I hang out. Hell, he we are choked with anons who have nothing to say apart from the fact that anyone who thinks that there were really planes is disinfo shill. What!? Where's the logic in that?

Like I said above, there's nothing no-planes can bring to the 911 discussion that the thermite and collapses won't do quicker and better. Hell, they're already there on those. It's a done deal. Now all that has to happen is for enough people to see them and we're there.

Unless of course we all grind to a halt and start again on a logic-free and evidenceless no-plane meme.

Okay, I've just convinced myself. From here on in I'm not wasting another moment on no-planes. And you aside mate, I'll be viewing all no-planers as spooks (or useful idiots, ahem).

Sorry if I hurt your feelings Slozo but you might want to ditch this one, if for no other reason than on account of who you're running with. Check these anonymous arseholes out. They ain't pretty are they? The government has to pile in on this. They've got no choice.

The Realist Report said...

First off, please feel free to comment on my reply at my blog. If you don't want to, that's fine. If you do, I won't delete your comment. That is unless you start talking about my family and personal life, as others have tried to do. I encourage constructive criticism.

You still didn't answer my question: what have I ever said that has been "hateful"?

I'm going to put up a post in the near future (I'm busy as I'm sure you are) regarding my stance on the "no plane" issue, which is a complete misnomer to begin with. I hope you at least take a look. All I've ever said is that Boeing 757s/767s, which we're told hit the Pentagon, WTC 1 & 2, and crashed at Shanksville, were not involved on 9/11. At least, there is ZERO evidence for this claim. And if my past comments haven't been as clear as what I'm saying now, I apologize.

I am not saying there were "no planes" on 9/11. I'm saying, specifically, that there is no evidence that any Boeing 757s/767s were involved anywhere on 9/11. I've repeatedly emphasized at kenny's and other places that I don't know what hit the WTC or anywhere on 9/11. Maybe it was a missile that hit the towers? Maybe a drone? Maybe a remote controlled airplane that Dov Zakheim's company made? I don't know.

I'm also saying that there is pretty good evidence that many, if not all, of the videos in New York on 9/11 were faked, and that there is evidence that many of the victims, passengers, and hijackers were faked as well. 9/11 is a complete fraud, from start to finish, in every aspect you take a close look at.

I think this is an important angle in figuring out the most monumental PSYOP/crime in human history, the crime that has ushered in the New World Order, or whatever you want to call it.

Please listen to that. It's great, even if you don't like rap (which, generally speaking, I don't).

I think it's an issue ("no planes") that should be rationally discussed and debated in the forums we're familiar with. Not many want to I've discovered. That's fine. But I'd like to. And I'm going to engage with those that have an open mind to this subject, and challenge those that rebut it. That's what you did nobody. And it was an extremely poor effort at that. I'm not trying to be a dick, I'm just saying.

continued below.......

The Realist Report said...

I'm not sure if you're aware, but I do actually talk to a lot of people about 9/11, in my personal life, professional life (when I can, of course), and through the San Diegans for 9/11 Truth Group that we have here. And no, I don't bring up the planes. I keep it basic, extremely basic.

nobody, the last adjective that describes me is incurious. I've always been skeptical about things, and when I figured out 9/11, I was fucking floored man. Well, I guess I haven't "figured it out" (no one has, which is why we should keep talking and learning about it), but I do know that it is a major lie that has completely destroyed any credibility the government that rules the land where I live has over me. It was the event in my lifetime that has completely shaped who I am as a person, and what I stand for in this short period of time I have here on this earth. At least for now. Who knows what these fucks have up their sleeve.

Since I've been awake to 9/11 Truth (fall '09), I've learned a lot about the world, history and the global power structure. It's basically the exact opposite of what I had just learned in university (graduated Dec. '08). Fuck me, how much do I owe those assholes for teaching me a bunch of bullshit, when I could have learned the real truth on the internet long ago?

When I decided to start blogging, I wanted to be open and honest. That and the fact that I have zero creative abilities led me to use my real name to start blogging, John Friend. I write comments on blogs that I think are interesting. I say exactly what is on my mind, and I am honest about what I say. I want the world to know where I stand on the most important issues facing humanity. Plus, I want those assholes in Langley and Tel Aviv who are reading this to know that there are still real patriots, real men, out there that aren't afraid to tell the psychopaths to FUCK OFF.

Finally, I really do think you're a phenomenal writer man. Just reading the comments here and the few articles I have actually read on your blog clearly show you're extremely witty, humorous, and sharp. I'm just telling you how I see it. That must be a new concept for you here on the internet? Or in life generally? You think I would suck up to you, or Timster, or anyone, by offering fake compliments? Sorry dude, that's not my style. Everything I wrote I meant. And still do.

Anyways, you can take or leave what I just said here. I hope you at least heard me out. Peace bro.

Anonymous said...

Many thanks for the invite.

- Aangirfan

Franz said...

Slozo --

I think ROOTS OF HEAVEN is still around, best bet might be yard sales or some such. I know I had a copy years upon years ago in the Navy, and it wasn't new then.

I seriously did want nobody's take on the DVD, no diss was intended. Because the movie was a bust it was never OFFICIALLY put on DVD here in the states, thus the copy I have is actually a region-free, totally legal bootleg. Curiosity got the better of me and I got it from a local guy.

And it is, as I say, good intro to the Gary novel. Romaine Gary was a Jewish writer who killed himself but put much of the truth as he knew it in the book. Also had a hand in the screenplay, his being a pal of Orson Welles probably got that part sold, eh?

By this time probably way, way off topic, offer holds regardless. Because ROOTS OF HEAVEN is about saving elephants but... after you catch the joke, not really. The ROOTS OF HEAVEN at this point is a world-wide cult of people who know it opens the door just a bit, but the right bit.

Anonymous said...

I don't "know" either of you, but from what I just read in this post, I would say that the anonymous commenter that wrote:

nobody, for a guy who "doesn't care what people think" you sure do tell us how you "don't care what people think" of you a lot.

And for saying John Friend doesn't deserve another word from you, you sure did just write quite a few towards him. Make up your fucking mind you assclown.

Is spot on.

For someone so hellbent on saving the rest of us from the cointelpro spooks like John (ahem), you sure do know how to put down lots and lots of words that simply bored me to tears and certainly didn't convince me that he is a spook (and makes me even more suspicious of you).

And John said you were a writer. If anything, I question his judgement on that issue.

Don't worry about checking the stat counter. This will be my only visit.

nobody said...

Beulahman, you're absolutely right.

John, here's what I'm going to do. This is prompted by the ever spooky P2P, who in the kindest fashion possible make me wonder at the point of all this. I won't delete this post but I'm going to edit the header so that it's won't feature as heavily in google results.

And then that's it, I quit this discussion. And one's like it. It's worthless and reflects as poorly on me as anyone. I still think no planes are bullshit and that anyone who thinks that that's the key to anything (and who aren't spooks) want to wonder at themselves. They ain't doing anyone any favours.

You can pile back in here if you like, do whatever, I'm ignoring it.

Meanwhile I'll be writing something new to push this shit down the page and off it soon enough.

ciao regazzi

nobody said...

Actually, in bowing before the wisdom of the sage P2P I asked if I wouldn't be better off just deleting the whole thing. She said it was where my head was at at the time and besides which others had contributed things to the comments. But where my head was at is nothing too special and the comments in question aren't mine, they belong to others.

So I throw it open. Will I delete this entire entry? Or leave it here? No need for non-regulars to express an opinion and anons will be ignored.

Folks what do you say?

Edo said...

Keep it up Nobody.

Whether you were right on this or wrong (I suspect probably wrong), you have made some sharp observations along the way.

kikz said...

my personal 2... wait... there's no 'cents' key on my board.. nevermind...

planes... no planes... immaterial.
'airborne craft(s)' cover that.

what interests me more; holes put into NORAD response protocols by cheney/rummy/neocon cast of 100's including all 'dual' foreign nationals. especially dov zakheim who was comptroller over the pentagon, and that 2.3 trillion that poofed leads us to 'the money trail'. cui bono? where did it go? black ops? the AG budget.. they hide stuff there all the time......who did/allowed this to happen? follow the money and follow the promotions, follow the trades (shorting the airlines) made b4 9/11. . find the bastards and persecute for treason.

lastly undo the dreadful patriot act and all associated; new DHS BS, TSA groping and all legislation passed that has hobbled our freedoms and overridden our Constitution and turned what was left of this country into a police state.

DEW's.. possibility exists; and whoelse would have it? of course the mil........and it also feeds into the 'nazi helping' space aliens push frm the MSM, that's been absolutely 'mainlined' of late.
why? added fear factor for possible blue beam holographic OP. shrugz....?

sorry i'm w/sagan on this.. ET'll just hafta land in yard and call me out to tea for me to confirm that one.

yeah, there's life out there.. but to borrow sentiment frm douglas adams; i think we're under galactic quarantine for general stupidity. somewhere a beacon is beaming out a warning signal... idiots at play...........avoid contact. :)

so many other windmills to charge...
noby... so many warrens occupied w/snakes we can name and find and drag out into the light and behead.
personally i think your strong mind would be better utilized in those pursuits.

gallier2 said...

IMO don't remove it. If JF is a cointelpro you've exposed him. If his genuine, you've showed his mono-maniacal obsession and lack of meta-reflection (seeing the big picture) i.e. not interesting.

The Realist Report said...

Leave it up!

kikz said...


patrick's latest of les's latest

orig post

just hadta share :)
whatta vibe. :)

slozo said...

Dear Nobody,
I can see (and understand, to some extent) that you are bat-shit tired of talking about no you-know-whats on you-know-when. However, I continue to strongly disagree with almost all of your argumentation for it, you writing it off, and your assumptions on it. In the end, of course it isn't the end of the world as long as we are all on the same page on 9/11 and the building demos and whatnot. But to write it off as disinfo just because it is a divisive subject . . . is very wrong, IMHO. No such assumptions are made, for instance, about believing in the moon landings (seeing is believing) or not as being the key to determining whether any of us are disinfo agents or not. Hey, we are all searching for truth out there, and we are all surrounded by shit (cointelpro stuff) that represents every side to every theory on what went down. There are a hundred different techniques to divide and conquer, and as we have seen with many a limited hangout agent, they all have an angle. Like playing poker with pros, it's never about just pretending to have the opposite of what you have . . . you have to style your disinformation to the receiver.

I did have a good laugh at your drunk guy getting kicked out of a bar analogy, though. How could you know (I may or may not have mentioned it ever here) that I was a bartender and basically the bouncer as well when needed for quite a few years, and have seen that situation a hundred times? And you know, it wasn't a bad analogy . . . because at the end of the day, people are most definitely NOT propelled only by singular, easy to pin down desires. Sometimes, a guy would really like the bar, the atmosphere, the people. Sometimes, he'd be just stubborn. Sometimes, it was wounded pride that brought him back. Othertimes, there was a hot girl who went there that he really wanted to see. Many other times, who the fuck knows. And sometimes they had a screw loose. And life is like that, and just like bars, I find that many blogs are like that to some limited extent.

Have I noticed the no-planes thing getting ramped up lately? Not really. Have I noticed the "men never went to the moon" thing getting ramped up lately? Yes. Sometimes disinfo has to ramp up alongside public questioning of things, so as to steer it later. Other times, disinfo invents "issues" wholesale. It's often tough to judge, but in examining a subject more closely to determine what is happening . . . is rarely a waste of time.

BTW, never quoted Gallier, only explained that a previous comment discussion with/against him had propelled me to re-examine things.

But as you wish, I will just leave it be for now.

ps - Why erase it? Not sure of your reasoning.

nobody said...

Very good.

This piece received a lot of criticism, more than any other I think. And it was well deserved.

In thinking about it, where I went wrong was in the writing. The entire initial angle, ie. the foundation on which everything was then laid, was wrong. Subsequently everything that followed was doomed. And it's obvious really - repetition > the absurd length > lack of clarity > and the desperate attempts to fix it by way of more of the same. It was just a disaster.

My flipping out and asking all and sundry if I should delete it was actually based on my embarassment at having such a piece of poorly written shit sitting on my blog for all of posterity (if you know what I mean). And frankly such embarassment is no one's kettle of fish but mine.

So I'll leave the damn thing here (albeit renamed with the original title) and cringe every time I see it score a hit in statcounter. Suitable punishment.

Otherwise I'll address all this in the next piece. Or to put it another way, not address it at all, if that makes sense. Anyway, later.

Anonymous said...

Frankly, I see NO need for any writer's remorse. No planes? Jim Fetzer? Gordon Duff? etc. I always assumed the kid was just a dizzard -- but cointelpro MAY BE right.

A. J. MacDonald, Jr said...

I certainly agree with you about Mr Friend and his continual harping on the no planes nonsense. Did he mention no planes? He doesn't mean to distract the discussion but did he mention no planes on 9/11. Not to distract from the more important issues but did he he tell you there were no ....

Anonymous said...

Satanic Voices, Ancient and Modern by David Musa Pidcock - most interesting.

- Aangirfan

piety piet said...

from august 5th:
woman speaking of her husband gunther who was arrested 2 days after
they married, his jailers releasing and reincarcerating him a number of
cycles. This lady claims Lybia* in the fifties was the pedophile capital of
the world.
Idris ruled over that and ran away to england when Ghaddafi threw him
* - 78 vs 62 miljan hits for libya vs lybia (german spelling is lybien)
good enough reason for some to go to war over i expect

talkstreamlive -- poorrichards - ralen's radio rmn ??? ... ok
and yet the station hasn't reported on lybia for nearly a month????
put on la(te)st nobby thread?

2 posts - 1 author - Last post: 7 Mar
Libya - Faction Two - The Monarchy - NWO Pedophile Trade - Ancient
... ...

You are here : » butlincat, Latest Articles »
Lesbian Cult, Pedophile Oaths, And Guilds
Posted On Thursday, 10 Mar 2011. Under: butlincat, Latest Articles.

Rayelan has twice the listenership of Glenn Beck? who wouldathunk
libya last tagged 13th of july

rupert said...

go to the 33rd second and watch the handshake and the forefinger. 33 seconds must coincedence right.....

question, what is your prime (definitive) piece of evidence to disprove the no planes theory. i've seen nothing to definitively disprove it, so remain not fully closed to the idea.